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Sep 28, 2022

My guest today is a longtime friend and colleague, Jon MacDonald. 

Jon is the CEO and founder of, The Good. He and his team help brands like Nike, Xerox, and The Economist turn more visitors into customers. 

He’s one of the best conversion rate optimization specialists I know.

In this interview, we wanted to go beyond the typical hacks and quick tips and look at principle-based optimization or optimization as a way of doing business. This approach will yield far greater results over the long haul than just trying the CRO-hack “flavor of the day.”

Here’s a look at what we cover: 

  • Why best practices are for beginners and how you should think about CRO in general.
  • What most eComm brand owners forget about the scientific method and why chasing “silver bullets” is killing your results. 
  • New visitors are at your site for two reasons, and it’s not just to hang out or learn all about you.
  • How Jon’s simple yet effective “Trust Trifecta” will help you earn more conversions. 
  • What Kim Kardashian’s assistant can teach you about "surprise and delight" user experiences.
  • How discounting isn’t optimization; it’s margin drain. And what you can do instead of discounting.
  • Plus more!